Microforge Technology...

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

When this edge hard press cut a thick zip tie where edge impact backing at an angle off perpendicular/vertical - it likely results with chip(s), especially at the corners of MF creases. Charpy test for brittle steels are mostly (almost always) un-notch type. These notches below are more/less stress risers, which is much worse than a V notch.

I don't know how hard the edge is... I can tell it's harder than any other knife I've MicroForged so far... simply because the indentations aren't as deep.

I'm not sure you can 'read' that much into my pictures (cracks, chips, etc.)... this knife became a test knife a while back... and has been "sharpening abused" for lack of a better term. You can see the numerous bevels, uneven grind lines, etc. I mostly just wanted to see if the MF would work on it. FWIW... I tried to snap some photos thru a 60x pocket scope (of the 110V)... not sure if it really helps or not though.

 

[cbwx34]

One thing our designers did differently for the culinary line was to reverse the direction of the abrasive belt in the electric sharpeners. The reason? This places the "uphill" travel of the belt on the same side of the blade that the vast majority of people will be MicroForging. One swipe through on Refine mode and the MicroForged edge is in ideal condition for sharpness and durability.

So, this seems to confirm what I mentioned earlier... that a bit more "sharpening refinement" as opposed to just the "10 light alternating strokes" the instructions indicate... does a better job of cleaning up the edge... and greatly improves it.

Interesting that the belt direction influences this also... good to know.

 

[cbwx34]

When this edge hard press cut a thick zip tie where edge impact backing at an angle off perpendicular/vertical - it likely results with chip(s), especially at the corners of MF creases. Charpy test for brittle steels are mostly (almost always) un-notch type. These notches below are more/less stress risers, which is much worse than a V notch.

So I pushcut a ziptie... straight down, and at an angle (banging the edge into a cuttingboard)... then whittled on the ziptie (all at the belly area of the blade, you can see it's sorta shiny in that area)... if there's any damage I can't see it under the pocket microscope...

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Thanks for testing my wrong speculation... corrected by your result. Confirmation pics (to compare your prev & afterward)?

Edit to ask: what material is the cutting board? If plastic and don't mind, please try bamboo or harder backing. Thx

So I pushcut a ziptie... straight down, and at an angle (banging the edge into a cuttingboard)... then whittled on the ziptie (all at the belly area of the blade, you can see it's sorta shiny in that area)... if there's any damage I can't see it under the pocket microscope...

 

[cbwx34]

Thanks for testing my wrong speculation... corrected by your result. Confirmation pics (to compare your prev & afterward)?

Edit to ask: what material is the cutting board? If plastic and don't mind, please try bamboo or harder backing. Thx

It is a plastic cutting board (all I have).

Tried a couple of shots (same area, different light angle)... sorry, crappy I know...

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Let's granted that edge with non-pointy scallop serration yields higher performance for general cutting tasks. Now we evaluate the 'how' part of turning PE into this PES (plain edge with scallops).

MF uses impact to create apex divots at certain depth and spacing. Let's generously call these divots as serrated scallops. Thus inherit same perf gain as 'granted'. This method is fast in creation and sync-refresh.

Vs

Diamond file + a fine comb - abrades at about 30 chisel degrees (just pick a side). This method will create pure PES, has sharp scallop edge. It could take an hour to create 8" of PES with 0.5-1mm gap scallops. And a few minutes to refresh.

MF approach effectiveness or destructiveness depends on steels properties, esp plasticity range. Low hrc and carbide volume% have wider plasticity range, so MF can effectively displaced+teared steel. High hrc and or carbide volume% have proportionally narrower plasticity range, so for same MF's impact force - less steels being displaced, balance of force (I would consider) destructive to create visible fracture+crease and impact load on steel.

As you can see in this case, plasticity range of hardened Vanadis 4E is about 4mm per spec (iicr 100mm long, 5mm diameter, hence ~4%). So anything beyond 4% is fracture.

Inspired by cbx34 test on s110v. I tried to create divot on s110v 65rc using corner of 60 grit diamond file, both by pressure and impact at slightly off 90 degrees (mostly compressive, low lateral) = chips, chips. Not a surprise, right. So logically or better rationale - I freehand (no comb) 3 scallops with 120 grit round diamond file = voi'la. With just these 3 scallops PES (not very sharp) - it whittled African Blackwood very well, while the rest of the PE doesn't dig AB very well.

btw - PES isn't new nor patented.

 

[HeavyHanded]

Let's granted that edge with non-pointy scallop serration yields higher performance for general cutting tasks. Now we evaluate the 'how' part of turning PE into this PES (plain edge with scallops).

MF uses impact to create apex divots at certain depth and spacing. Let's generously call these divots as serrated scallops. Thus inherit same perf gain as 'granted'. This method is fast in creation and sync-refresh.

Vs

Diamond file + a fine comb - abrades at about 30 chisel degrees (just pick a side). This method will create pure PES, has sharp scallop edge. It could take an hour to create 8" of PES with 0.5-1mm gap scallops. And a few minutes to refresh.

MF approach effectiveness or destructiveness depends on steels properties, esp plasticity range. Low hrc and carbide volume% have wider plasticity range, so MF can effectively displaced+teared steel. High hrc and or carbide volume% have proportionally narrower plasticity range, so for same MF's impact force - less steels being displaced, balance of force (I would consider) destructive to create visible fracture+crease and impact load on steel.

As you can see in this case, plasticity range of hardened Vanadis 4E is about 4mm per spec (iicr 100mm long, 5mm diameter, hence ~4%). So anything beyond 4% is fracture.

Inspired by cbx34 test on s110v. I tried to create divot on s110v 65rc using corner of 60 grit diamond file, both by pressure and impact at slightly off 90 degrees (mostly compressive, low lateral) = chips, chips. Not a surprise, right. So logically or better rationale - I freehand (no comb) 3 scallops with 120 grit round diamond file = voi'la. With just these 3 scallops PES (not very sharp) - it whittled African Blackwood very well, while the rest of the PE doesn't dig AB very well.

btw - PES isn't new nor patented.

I used to do a macro version with round file or diamond rod. Alternate sides and cut single serration about 1/4" on center. Stop the scallop so the lowest point on the backside is still within the grind bevel. Don't worry about burr.

Using a diamond file and the old jig for the crosscuts when I was making Washboards by hand I could cut a nice pattern pretty quick. Use the serration solution with the Universal Clamp and all the angles dead on with uniform spacing, whatever on-center repeat you want.

 

[UnknownVT]

FWIW - Just to give an idea of scale of the Micro-Forge spacing -

I think the spacing is very important, and I believe part of their patent.

--
Vincent

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Youtube.com/user/vtVincent
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UnknownVincent.Shutterfly.com
UnknownVT.Shutterfly.com

 

[UnknownVT]

One thing I noted this afternoon... if you spend a bit more time cleaning up the edge on the side opposite the MicroForge wheel (so if you push it thru the slot with your right hand... the left side of the blade), both with the ceramic rod, and/or a strop... it greatly improves the edge. In other words... don't treat both sides the same... a bit extra on the opposite side, (which makes sense I reckon, since that's where the metal goes....).

Yes, well observed - this is a very important point.

If we look at the good microscope pics from Dan Dovel of WorkSharp -
Side with the Micro-Forge "scallops"

Side opposite the MF

By honing/refining this side - one actually put an edge into the scallops - so that cutting is not only by the original plain edge (before MF) but the entire "scallop" is also now edged/sharp.

--
Vincent

Flickr.com/UnknownVincent/albums
Youtube.com/user/vtVincent
Goo.gl/q91ZNw
UnknownVincent.Shutterfly.com
UnknownVT.Shutterfly.com

 

[cbwx34]

I sharpened the MicroForge out of the Dividend I posted earlier... it worked well enough, but I found I like a bit "finer" edge on an EDC... and kept feeling the need to touch up the MicroForge edge. Nothing scientific... just my impression, and the use the knife typically sees. If I was doing something like cutting a lot of cardboard, I would put the MicroForge edge back on, and see how it performed.

Still have it on the kitchen knives I've done though... I'm liking it there. A fine edge with "bite" that is more than satisfactory, and has held up well so far.

I did have an unusual experience though... I tried to MicroForge a really cheap Faberware knife... and it actually cracked the blade. I got to pushing on the steel with a small round rod, and the steel in the area of the crack was really soft, almost rubberlike, it was different than the rest of the blade... so definitely an issue with the steel (although you'd think if it was soft it wouldn't crack, maybe it got hard again right at the crack... but not my area of expertise). Anyway, thought it was worth mentioning... really cheap knives may not hold up, and it was a cheapie. (In hindsight, should have seen if WorkSharp wanted it to look at, but just got rid of it).

Edit: BTW... made a "toolroll" out of some plastic... this would be nice with a real one....

 

[CLoeffler]

CBWX34- Could you shoot me an email at chrisL@darex.com? I had a question or two and can't find a way to message you.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Just had my Worksharp Culinary set land and immediately took the Microforge tool for a spin on an Arti weed cutter scythe blade. It works. I probably won't use it for most knives, but in this context, I'm liking it so far. The mini-serrations are very fine, shallow, and easily sharpened out with a handful of strokes from a 120 grit stone. I haven't plugged in the power sharpener yet, but initial impressions in just looking at it are that it looks cleverly designed, is compact, and has excellent overall build quality. Belt changes are intuitive enough that I was able to immediately identify how to do it without reading the instructions first (though I read them after.) The ceramic honing rod has both a grooved, flat "steel" surface, and a rounded, smooth surface, with opposing faces like some Scandinavian butcher's steels, so you can use a typical front/back stroke of a conventional steel with either surface type. The rod has a magnetic base that slips into the grip (that the Microforge tool is in) and the grip holds the rod firmly. There's a tiny noticeable wobble in the rod when inserted, but it shouldn't cause any functional problems in use.

 

[cbwx34]

That’s a ‘helluva’ blade to MicroForge....

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

That’s a ‘helluva’ blade to MicroForge....

Given that Euro scythe blades are beveled by peening, and cut best with a toothy edge, it's kind of an ideal match, really.

 

[cbwx34]

I’ll take your word for it.... I was just messin’ with you.

Kinda surprised you got one though (especially the E5)... any particular plan for it?

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

The folks at Darex/Work Sharp were kind enough to send 'em to me for evaluation. I actually didn't think I was going to have much use for the E5 sharpener, as anything it does I can do with my belt grinders faster and easier, but the design is nice enough and super compact that I think it'll be very useful for when I have to do heavy reshaping work of very worn knives for friends/family. They even managed to tuck a cute little storage compartment under the arm of the top pulley for extra belts. The M3 was mostly what I was looking forward to getting my hands on, and the Microforge wheel on it. I see it as having limited ideal applications...but for those applications I have to confess that it seems to be working nicely, and I kind of hope that they come out with something similar to a Carbee Sharp carbide scraper/sharpener with a Microforge wheel on it. I think it'd be just the thing for vegetation-slashing tools and improving edge retention and bit on culinary and butcher's knives that have fairly soft steel. I used it on some Rada Cutlery knives with the cast aluminum handles and it seems to have greatly assisted them in holding an effective edge. Those things typically blunt the second you look at them wrong, while they're now holding their edge as well as a Victorinox. Victorinox knives may not be famous for their edge retention either, but it's a big step up from what they were!

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Some further notes. The electric E5 totally saved the day at Thanksgiving when I was pressed into cutting the (incredible) turkey on short notice and the slicing knife was dull as butter (it was at a family member's place, not mine!) Even with an aggressive stone on hand like my Manticore, it wouldn't have been fast enough to reset the heavily worn bevel in time to satisfy hungry folks who wanted to eat right that minute, so I popped out the E5 and ran the blade through a few times on "shape" mode with the stock belt and then deburred on the grooved portion of the ceramic "steel" and it was cutting nice and easy. Didn't even bother with the other, slower modes since I know how to operate high-speed belt grinders without mucking a blade up, and it did very nicely. Not a situation I'll be caught in often, but it worked.

I was given some heavily worn industrial butcher's knives to work on later in the get-together and had to resort to the coarse belt and wide-angle guides from the accessory kit on it because it would have taken too long to reshape the thickened edge otherwise, as I didn't want to make too much of a prolonged ruckus, but it performed well, belt changes were fast and easy, and I used the Microforge wheel on a few of their knives to help keep 'em cutting a bit longer than they otherwise would under their typical conditions of use.

This is less of a machine for someone doing work for others so much as for home maintenance, and a couple of my relations were impressed by the ease of use of the machine. For their purposes I could see this as very much being a good option for simplified guided sharpening, though I'd suggest they have an experienced sharpener set the initial bevels for them on the machine the first time so that they're brought to a full apex at the right angle for use with the unit--you still have to know how to read a scratch pattern to see if you're reaching the edge to know if you're done on the first stage, and that's more than most lay-persons will know how to do still. All in all, it's a good little machine that should serve its target demographic very well.

If I hadn't been so kindly provided with one for testing I'd never have been compelled to purchase one due to the price point (which is quite fair for the quality) due to my skill level with manual sharpening and owning more powerful grinders already, but having it around is going to be pretty convenient, I have to say.

 

[bfrshooter]

I was sent the micro Forge tool to test. I made a short video but can not figure how to get it here. I tried my Kodak camera and can't get it to my computer so I had a friend use his laptop, sent it to me but I can't move it to save. Being old does not help. The instructions are easy but I did not bother to run the blades over the ceramic after forging. The blades are sharp and I am known for sharpening to a razor. Paper is not easy so the edges drag some but I gave the knife to the wife to cut a venison roast for stew. It cut silver skin and tendons easy. It really works on meat.
All my hunting knives are done on my Ken Onion to get thickness down. I butcher all my deer and a sharp edge goes fast and I hate serrated blades but these are so small they don't drag. They seem to make the edge harder. I can say they are scary sharp. I really like the results. I used it on a 65 year old Herters knife that has been sharpened so much it is narrow and hard to sharpen. Then on a Case folding Hunter that is a razor after 40 years. Then a Cold Steel. All are not to be touched now. I have cut over 560 deer and know a knife so I am impressed with the tool but have to wait for the next season. A steel does the same to align the edges but the Micro Forge is better.
Now tell me how to get my video here from an E mail.

 

[bfrshooter]

I have more tools then anyone to sharpen. I even make my own cherries and make bullet molds. I make lathe cutters. I have the ability to sharpen drill bits by hand but the Drill Doctor has to be for the small drills. Wonderful tool.
The Micro Forge does work but you need the knife sharp first. It will NOT sharpen a dull knife. If you can't shave first it will not save you. The ceramic rod is there to help. I have been with a friend that killed a deer, took his knife out and a RR rail was sharper. I gave him mine and he never seen a knife so sharp. Same when I gave deer away, the guy could never open a deer. Knife was a wood stick. I had to gut for him. I swear I cold cut a hair in half.
Work Sharp tools work to shorten time for an edge.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

The MicroForge slot is for use after sharpening. It's not a sharpener, but an edge-shaping process. It's suggested to give a quick swipe or two on the face opposite the micro-serrations to true up any burr formed during the process.