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Bad Survive! Deserves A Permanent Post In The Hall Of Shame

GAGL GAGL Sorry to bother you, had another question, hopefully you can help because I don't know what to call it.

Ok, let's say that....let's say I'm a knifemaker, and I accept preorders for...let's say, a thousand (1,000) knives. Ok? 1,000 knives, I just like round numbers, so we'll keep it simple. So, I accept 1,000 preorders for my new super duper wonder knife. Let's call it the HDP 4.7. Pretty cool right? Dude, it's so sweet, best knife on the market. It is, because I and my newsletters and rabid fans lured in by scarcity say so. Anyway, I ask for, and get paid $225,000 for these knives (again, upfront) that don't technically exist yet. Sweet! Now, I'm not known for timeliness, ok? People know it's going to take awhile. See, I outsource about 90% of my product to other companies. Blade blanks, handle scales, sheathes, all that. I am a sharpening savant, you know, so I don't have time for any of that other nonsense. So, it's going to take awhile. BUT, I've got that $225,000 in my pocket.

Now, suddenly...SUDDENLY, my customers notice that I've posted up sales links for...let's call them HDP 4.7 "seconds". These are knives which somehow are flawed in some way* and I've decided to offer them for sale at a discounted rate, so let's say...$200.00. I have thirty or forty of them, and again, ask for payment up front. Sweet, an additional several grand! Just for putting up words on my website! Oddly, this new sale isn't long after the sale for this model dropped.

So, let me ask you: what would you call selling "seconds" (which again means a product that's damaged cosmetically in some way, but that is still technically sound) of a product...THAT DOESN'T EVEN EXIST YET?

Asking for a friend. :)



* Which is what being a "second" almost universally means in the knife world.

why so upset about me trying to find examples of people being scammed by them?

would you give me a respectful answer if i had 5000 posts instead of 128?

the 7.7 was just an example.i don't remember which models have been finished so far.

what i want to find out:

SK makes a model, GSO X.X,t
they build,assemble all orders
they claim they shipped all of them

is there somebody out there that did not receive their knife they paid for in advance?
 
Your posts here with their tone of "All of you, and years of direct observation must be wrong because I received a knife I ordered, and their newsletters and some Instagram posts said everything is going great" is probably why you're seen as a shill. Just being objective here.
never said i received anything.
only that i got an answer from them.

you need to calm down a bit.
maybe take your mask off and take a deep breath

edit: i take evidence over observations any day,as observations can be tainted by the observer.

edit edit:
also feel free to put me on ignore if my questions upset you so much.
i'm just trying to find out if i got scammed,and if so i actually got proof because they said they will ship my order this week.

your logic: everybody that doesn't share my viewpoint is a liar and a shill.pathetic

nice way to treat the people that allegedly got scammed by them.
 
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never said i received anything.
only that i got an answer from them.

you need to calm down a bit.
maybe take your mask off and take a deep breath

So, you believe them, over all the facts and observations of their behavior. Got it.

Also, I AM calm. If I weren't, you'd know it. You're a S?K defender who keeps trying to tell us you aren't. It might be better to just be honest. Thanks!
 
why so upset about me trying to find examples of people being scammed by them?

would you give me a respectful answer if i had 5000 posts instead of 128?

the 7.7 was just an example.i don't remember which models have been finished so far.

what i want to find out:

SK makes a model, GSO X.X,t
they build,assemble all orders
they claim they shipped all of them

is there somebody out there that did not receive their knife they paid for in advance?

Many people in the threads I mention ( @Fixall was being polite, I'm not, do your own research) have stated that they never received their knives.

I'll ask you directly:

1. Do you think it's the mark of a quality company to take thousands of orders for a model of knife, fail to deliver that knife after years and years of promises and delays, all the while releasing preorders for new models (and of course taking those upfront payments)? ANY effort that was expended on new knives was effort that wasn't expended on getting you, the customer, the product you paid for. If they were a larger company, it might be believable that the product development team and the product production team were different people, however, when there's like three or four people in your "company", if you are expending effort on new products without delivering old products, that's simply wrong. They want those upfront payments, once they have your money, they don't care about you. This, by the way, is something that has happened for years.

2. Do you think it's the mark of a quality company to sell "seconds" of products that haven't even been produced yet?
 
n

never said i received any knife from them.

can you quote me where i said that?

edit: you cant just claim i defended them without proof.simply saying i defended them doesn't change the fact that i din't.
I sincerely apologize, you commented during a conversation with a different member and I didn't pay attention to the names. I firmly retract the statement that you claimed you received a knife, but I stand by the first part of what I said.
 
Many people in the threads I mention ( @Fixall was being polite, I'm not, do your own research) have stated that they never received their knives.

I'll ask you directly:

1. Do you think it's the mark of a quality company to take thousands of orders for a model of knife, fail to deliver that knife after years and years of promises and delays, all the while releasing preorders for new models (and of course taking those upfront payments)? ANY effort that was expended on new knives was effort that wasn't expended on getting you, the customer, the product you paid for. If they were a larger company, it might be believable that the product development team and the product production team were different people, however, when there's like three or four people in your "company", if you are expending effort on new products without delivering old products, that's simply wrong. They want those upfront payments, once they have your money, they don't care about you. This, by the way, is something that has happened for years.

2. Do you think it's the mark of a quality company to sell "seconds" of products that haven't even been produced yet?

1.did i ever claim the opposite?

2.did i ever claim tbe opposite?

where did i say i received knives from them?

why can't you answer any of my questions and just change subject?

where is the example of somebody not receiving their built,shipped knife?

you're not gonna answer,aren't you?
 
1.did i ever claim the opposite?

2.did i ever claim tbe opposite?

where did i say i received knives from them?

why can't you answer any of my questions and just change subject?

where is the example of somebody not receiving their built,shipped knife?

you're not gonna answer,aren't you?

So, you agree then that S?K are thieves and liars? Excellent, I'm glad to see we're now on the same page. See guys, a little objectivity and logic always leads folks to the right answer!

Serious response, I've already told you once and it seems you missed it: I'm not doing your research for you, or "showing" you anything. I don't owe you that effort expenditure, especially when it's pretty clear that those things are out there to find. Here, Reddit, and elsewhere. It's on you to find those posts and threads. I'VE already seen them, and participated in a bunch of them.

If you choose not to believe me, ask yourself this: why did S?K's subforum get closed, and the Administration of this forum make it clear that they weren't welcome here anymore? :)
 
I sincerely apologize, you commented during a conversation with a different member and I didn't pay attention to the names. I firmly retract the statement that you claimed you received a knife, but I stand by the first part of what I said.

appreciate it

if you could point out where i defended them so i can give a rebuttal.that would be great,because i dont think i defended them at all
 
So, you agree then that S?K are thieves and liars? Excellent, I'm glad to see we're now on the same page. See guys, a little objectivity and logic always leads folks to the right answer! :)

they might be liars,yes.but thieves?! i need to see evidence first.

are you gonna answer any of my questions or just gonna answer with another question or claim.

i think you ran out of arguments.feel free to put me on ignore since i only got 130 posts
 
they might be liars,yes.but thieves?! i need to see evidence first.

are you gonna answer any of my questions or just gonna answer with another question or claim.

i think you ran out of arguments.feel free to put me on ignore since i only got 130 posts

I have already answered your questions, but because you're a shill for S?K, you choose not to believe them. Also, being unable to grasp the point being made by my rhetorical questions tells me what level of discourse I'm dealing with here. "I want to see evidence!" Then go find it. You don't get to claim we're wrong because you don't want to go back and read the years of threads that exist out there. Your laziness and dishonesty is on you, and none of us are under any directive to deal with it.
 
I have already answered your questions, but because you're a shill for S?K, you choose not to believe them. Also, being unable to grasp the point being made by my rhetorical questions tells me what level of discourse I'm dealing with here. "I want to see evidence!" Then go find it. You don't get to claim we're wrong because you don't want to go back and read the years of threads that exist out there. Your laziness and dishonesty is on you, and none of us are under any directive to deal with it.
i read all the SK here,as they were happening.

you came in here calling me names and a liar/shill etc. when all i wanted is to see an example of somebody not receiving their built/shipped knife.

now you just chicken out because there are none that you know of..

the classic "i don't owe you,do your own research" .
laughable.

calling others names without any evidence whatsoever.

i also never claimed anybody was wrong,just that i want to see evidence so i can make my own picture
 
i read all the SK here,as they were happening.

you came in here calling me names and a liar/shill etc. when all i wanted is to see an example of somebody not receiving their built/shipped knife.

now you just chicken out because there are none that you know of..

the classic "i don't owe you,do your own research" .
laughable.

calling others names without any evidence whatsoever.

i also never claimed anybody was wrong,just that i want to see evidence so i can make my own picture

Yes, I've called you a shill because you're here doing the same thing countless shills in the past have done, where you try to defend S?K by "just asking some questions, just trying to be objective, just want to see some evidence." It's the sort of thing that people who have no proof of their own position try to do so as to appear informed. The irony here is immense. Has S?K delivered all knives? How would you know? Plenty of people here say they haven't. They aren't thieves? How would you know? Have you ordered a knife from them, and watched them put out years worth of new products all while not delivering yours? No? Hmmm....

Also, I find it amusing that you're attempting to portray your laziness as my problem. That pretty much sums up all your posts, really. You've already been told to go find the evidence yourself, because those posts ARE there. The posts where the owner of this site told Guy and Ellie they aren't welcome here anymore ARE there. The posts where all the timelines of the lies told and claims made by S?K ARE there. The only thing laughable is your belief that another adult needs to spoonfeed you. Wipe your mouth, tie your own shoes, and do your own search. I was there, and posted in most of those threads. Good luck.
 
S?K is moving to a new state of the art workshop with state of the art classified security systems and state of the art think tanks and state of the art design studios and a massive in house museum of all of the S?K classified state of the art classic and historical knives. There is also a very nice car wash near by.

They're turning this ship around 360 degrees over the next weekend.
 
they might be liars,yes.but thieves?!
I will dive into some technicalities here on this "They can't be thieves if they make everyone whole". It is completely false to assume making everyone whole absolves one of any thievery and that no thievery was done. This mostly goes into financial fraud, which is technically a form of theft, if you take money use funds for a specific project on a different project or it sits ideal in an interest bearing account that is fraud. This can occur willfully or through neglect and it is still fraud either way and does not change the crime and would make them thieves even if it was thievery through ignorance.
 
appreciate it

if you could point out where i defended them so i can give a rebuttal.that would be great,because i dont think i defended them at all
i get your point and frustration..i've been waiting for the damn knife for over 5 years when initially i thought it wouldn't take more than 6-9 months.

as for the restocking fee:
if you enter a contract that states there will be a restocking fee in case of cancellation of an order,it's up to you if you want to "invest" your money. IIRC, they tried to get a restocking fee from people that paid before the fee was introduced.

That was/is very shady and i do not support that.
just because they didn't have a finished product doesn't mean they didn't have expenses for materials,machines etc.

also,every time you spend money on something, it "means the loss of any other goods or services that money could have purchased instead, as well as any investment potential it had".

not trying to attack you personally but that is a very strange way of looking at things.

i will never buy from them again but i have yet to see somebody being scammed by them.

it seems like they are actually delivering products.just with a huge delay.

all the delays and promises to "change everything and not take preorders ever again" is what got people mad,myself included.

again,i'm not a SK fanboy and i'm not here to shill for them.just trying to be objective.
I don't see how this post can be categorized as anything but defending them. You're defending them against being called scammers as well as defending their restocking fee policy.
 
Yes, I've called you a shill because you're here doing the same thing countless shills in the past have done, where you try to defend S?K by "just asking some questions, just trying to be objective, just want to see some evidence." It's the sort of thing that people who have no proof of their own position try to do so as to appear informed. The irony here is immense. Has S?K delivered all knives? How would you know? Plenty of people here say they haven't. They aren't thieves? How would you know? Have you ordered a knife from them, and watched them put out years worth of new products all while not delivering yours? No? Hmmm....

Also, I find it amusing that you're attempting to portray your laziness as my problem. That pretty much sums up all your posts, really. You've already been told to go find the evidence yourself, because those posts ARE there. The posts where the owner of this site told Guy and Ellie they aren't welcome here anymore ARE there. The posts where all the timelines of the lies told and claims made by S?K ARE there. The only thing laughable is your belief that another adult needs to spoonfeed you. Wipe your mouth, tie your own shoes, and do your own search. I was there, and posted in most of those threads. Good luck.

so 100% of people who come to ask questions and try to be objective are shills?

why is it so hard for you to share a simple link to a fellow forums member?

instead you write these crazy texts
 
so 100% of people who come to ask questions and try to be objective are shills?

why is it so hard for you to share a simple link to a fellow forums member?

instead you write these crazy texts

It isn't hard at all. I just detest lazy people who try to make their laziness other peoples' problem. Do your own research.
 
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