Speed checks, "pass it down", proxies, please read.

[Oyster]

Oyster and Cap’n Smudge , fair points from both of you. Personally it does not affect me, but remember I only spoke about the perception of fairness. To a group of outsiders, a group of insiders choosing winners and losers will not sit well. Just curious, is proxying prevalent across other forums?

I guess that’s a question of supply/demand and I am not familiar enough with other subforums. Having said that, I did get one of my most-prized Fiddlebacks with the aid of a proxy. So, I guess the answer is: it depends, and yes.

 

[WValtakis]

Just to clarify, where you place has nothing to do with connection speeds (I consistently have garbage internet), but rather I see it as "luck of the refresh". It's a matter a being here at the right second and then crossing your fingers...nothing more.

~Chip

 

[Oyster]

By my count the First page had 11 non buyers...I recognize the Usual Suspects and it's been going on for some time so if a Business is about just Having Fun then it's all good. If I just want to purchase a Knife in a Sales Thread I'm competing with Non-Buyers showing off their Speed Connection skills and NOT paying to keep the business open.

I admit - and have apologized to Jo after understanding the complications it creates for her - to participating as a backup proxy for folks that requested help in the dedicated thread. My motivation was to help counter the vagaries of the crazy sales and assist first-time buyers that didn’t have any success or are unable to participate themselves. I won’t be doing that in the future.
To be honest - and perhaps I don’t have a sufficiently good understanding of the technical side of this - apart from making it more difficult for Jo to determine who has which spot, I’m not sure how my participation without ultimately claiming a knife affects anyone after me since my spot simply falls to the next person in line.

 

[Grenock]

We all love the thrill of the Friday sales and there has been a fun past-time of seeing where you would come in with a post even if you're not actually buying a knife in the sale. That's all well and good and I encourage folks to have a good time if it's not hurting anything.

It has been brought to my attention that some of our Friday sales are relatively brisk and there appears there may be some minor issues with the forum software dealing with the little bump in volume we see sometimes at a certain time on Fridays. This is causing some folks to get error messages. This is causing some people who are new to CPK to become frustrated and walk away. If ten posts out of the first 30 are speed bumps it seems pretty clear to me it's contributing to the problem. So if you're not there to place an order I would ask you folks to please refrain from posting in sale threads for a while until the sales cool down a little or until the forum software is able to keep up better.

Also, a proxy is fine, but if you're posting a proxy without actually having set up a proxy yet and end up "passing it down" instead you may be contributing to the problem as well, in addition to creating clutter for Jo. Jo is getting frazzled with the additional volume we're producing. When Jo gets frazzled she murders kittens to blow off steam. If you contribute to her mental decline those dead kittens are on you.

All of this was never a problem when we were smaller and it was just a few folks, but it might be getting a little out of hand now, so I would ask that we scale it back a bit. I'm sure some folks might not see this thread or may forget and that's fine, but if we could just scale it back a little I think it would help.

Lastly, if you could edit your post from the place holder text to an actual order it would help.

None of this is a big deal. Knife collecting is supposed to be fun and I'm not here to tell folks what to do. But these are some suggestions that might help out a little while the sales are so brisk.

Hey Nathan, I am good to not speed test, proxy or pass down. Whatever you want, I am along for the ride all the same. I do have a legit question though as it pertains to my own past actions.

Obviously, no one has the time or inclination to attempt to read the ad before posting, that will just about always result in you being a no knife having sucka. So, I post the place holder as fast as possible as most do. Then I look at the ad to see what is being offered. On more than a few occasions, the scale materials I was looking for were not being offered. That turned those sales which I intended to complete into pass down/speed tests for me.

I always figured this was easier for those involved than bugging Jo before hand with hey, will you have this or that, which would be a message or email she would need to respond to if she even had the time prior to the sale. When the answer comes back"I'll check with Nathan" or " If I can get them done in time" I feel like I am adding more pressure and disruption as opposed to posting and seeing what I am looking for isn't there and just saying skip me. Also, regardless what she knows on say Wednesday or Thursday, sometimes changes by Friday as this is a fluid kinda thing that changes.

So, after all that long winded bullshit, I guess my question is, how do you want me to handle that in the future?


Last thought - I want it noted that when the league was disbanded, I sat atop the heap it's champion. I am retiring with the belt.

 

[Busto]

Just curious, is proxying prevalent across other forums?

Very Rarely will you see Proxy requests in Blade Forum Sales threads....CPK because of how few knives are released and how sought after they have become is open to this for every sale. There are some members that have the time and ability to sit ready to post as soon as Nathan opens the Sales Thread and are usually first to post regardless if they are buying or not. Even if you have a Proxy there is no Guarantee that you will get a knife also depends on how many are being sold.

 

[ndmiller]

Oyster and Cap’n Smudge , fair points from both of you. Personally it does not affect me, but remember I only spoke about the perception of fairness. To a group of outsiders, a group of insiders choosing winners and losers will not sit well. Just curious, is proxying prevalent across other forums?

Well said, I never thought about it that way and I've won through proxies and proxied for winners (and I've speed tested). Originally it was meant as a way to help someone out unavailable for the sale and pretty infrequent, while today it's very frequent with somewhat of an infrastructure.

With the continued massive rush to Friday sales (40 knives in a few minutes), I completely understand someone getting that vibe and it's at least fair observation someone could make.

On the subject of speed tests (i've done them), you're not really allowed to comment like this in other sale threads across BF, and most sellers detail "questions from IM" and report them in threads where Mods remove them. Good call.

 

[Oyster]

Last thought - I want it noted that when the league was disbanded, I sat atop the heap it's champion. I am retiring with the belt.

I think we all needed this

 

[Grenock]

By my count the First page had 11 non buyers...I recognize the Usual Suspects and it's been going on for some time so if a Business is about just Having Fun then it's all good. If I just want to purchase a Knife in a Sales Thread I'm competing with Non-Buyers showing off their Speed Connection skills and NOT paying to keep the business open.

I am sure I have helped keep the lights on, Sadie fed and beer in the fridge at least a day or two, thanks.

 

[Busto]

I admit - and have apologized to Jo after understanding the complications it creates for her - to participating as a backup proxy for folks that requested help in the dedicated thread. My motivation was to help counter the vagaries of the crazy sales and assist first-time buyers that didn’t have any success. I won’t be doing that in the future.
To be honest - and perhaps I don’t have a sufficiently good understanding of the technical side of this - apart from making it more difficult for Jo to determine who has which spot, I’m not sure how my participation without ultimately claiming a knife affects anyone after me since my spot simply falls to the next person in line.

Why are you posting in a Sales thread if you are not Buying? I get the Trying to Help part but in the Big Boy World we all take our chances and take our lumps win or lose. If a person wants a CPK bad enough they will find a way to be in the sales thread or any of the other Exchange threads...WTB for instance.

 

[Oyster]

Why are you posting in a Sales thread if you are not Buying? I get the Trying to Help part but in the Big Boy World we all take our chances and take our lumps win or lose. If a person wants a CPK bad enough they will find a way to be in the sales thread or any of the other Exchange threads...WTB for instance.

Simple answer: to assist those who can’t participate get a knife from the maker at the maker’s price and in good time for them to actually use it. Understand the frustration but also feel that anyone that can’t make it on their own is/was free to request help. Proxies don’t make up 40 spots. It’s generally 2 - 3...
*shrug*

 

[mpjustin]

Hey Nathan, I am good to not speed test, proxy or pass down. Whatever you want, I am along for the ride all the same. I do have a legit question though as it pertains to my own past actions.

Obviously, no one has the time or inclination to attempt to read the ad before posting, that will just about always result in you being a no knife having sucka. So, I post the place holder as fast as possible as most do. Then I look at the ad to see what is being offered. On more than a few occasions, the scale materials I was looking for were not being offered. That turned those sales which I intended to complete into pass down/speed tests for me.

I always figured this was easier for those involved than bugging Jo before hand with hey, will you have this or that, which would be a message or email she would need to respond to if she even had the time prior to the sale. When the answer comes back"I'll check with Nathan" or " If I can get them done in time" I feel like I am adding more pressure and disruption as opposed to posting and seeing what I am looking for isn't there and just saying skip me. Also, regardless what she knows on say Wednesday or Thursday, sometimes changes by Friday as this is a fluid kinda thing that changes.

So, after all that long winded bullshit, I guess my question is, how do you want me to handle that in the future?


Last thought - I want it noted that when the league was disbanded, I sat atop the heap it's champion. I am retiring with the belt.

I agree,

I would jump in for the chance of there being antique micarta or burlap and if not potentially pass my spot up. (Most of the time I also just picked another scale option, but still nice to have the option not knowing all the details of the sale).

It would be great if there was another way to know all the sale option details in advance.

 

[Oyster]

I suppose I could also say that in the Big Boy World, if a fellow can’t get one of the remaining 38 spots, I expect him to be man enough to ask for help.
Dunno what else to say...
Anyway, I don’t think we’ll be seeing too many proxies. Sucks for the guys/real men out in the field, but hey...

 

[Busto]

I am sure I have helped keep the lights on, Sadie fed and beer in the fridge at least a day or two, thanks.

Well...Good for you, but now you're just Gloating...

I agree,

I would jump in for the chance of there being antique micarta or burlap and if not potentially pass my spot up. (Most of the time I also just picked another scale option, but still nice to have the option not knowing all the details of the sale).

It would be great if there was another way to know all the sale option details in advance.

That is interesting...All the Details are in Nathan's Opening Post...But who wants to read all of that because you have to go the bottom of the post to actually see the Handle scale options...I agree if you want to be "IN" you skip the details and Post up ASAP.

 

[Casinostocks]

Topics which were discussed in the past, admittedly when the CPK subforum was not as populated as it is today:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/off-topic-proxy-sales-etiquette.1409492/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/share-your-thoughts-on-proxy-buying-please.1434725/

Some comments from my (1 hour) sleep deprived cabeza plus no coffee yet:

There's plenty of evidence that the CPK regulars have proxied for people who have requested for such favor, while not having established as much subforum foot print as much as some outsiders perceive to be the norm in here. I am not denying that having established "social credit" will not curry favors but it has not been a must and a prerequisite.

To totally do away with proxying will have the negative consequences of inflating the secondary market prices and you can bank on this one!

Lastly, when a business becomes a runaway success, it draws some unwanted attention and scrutiny. I feel that some of the criticism is warranted and some totally unwarranted; I don't know to what extent impugning the CPK sales threads and certain behaviors is within the main knife-makers Exchange section since it has already been mentioned that the rules over there seem to be far more relaxed. However, Nathan could have always stuck to presenting his sales in his own subforum and if you have noticed lately, the past 4 sales cycles have all been in the main area.

I had suggested some pointers in the past but Nathan always decides on the side of:

The less over burdening with extra rules = The easier to maintain the flow

 

[Busto]

Simple answer: to assist those who can’t participate get a knife from the maker at the maker’s price and in good time for them to actually use it. Understand the frustration but also feel that anyone that can’t make it on their own is/was free to request help. Proxies don’t make up 40 spots. It’s generally 2 - 3...
*shrug*

No Sweat...I tried to help out in the past and got burned so no Good Dead Goes Unpunished.

 

[Busto]

I suppose I could also say that in the Big Boy World, if a fellow can’t get one of the remaining 38 spots, I expect him to be man enough to ask for help.
Dunno what else to say...
Anyway, I don’t think we’ll be seeing too many proxies. Sucks for the guys/real men out in the field but, hey...

I actually waited Until the Last Slow sale for the HDFK and finally got in...but that is just years of patience...I make knives and have more than God allows but I enjoy them and if it's something I might want I will find one sooner or later. Help...I got this far in life without help to buy a knife...but then I'm in my late 60's how many more knives do I need. And Being a Real Man means you should be able to take care of your own needs and not have to rely on someone else to do it for you!

 

[Oyster]

No Sweat...I tried to help out in the past and got burned so no Good Dead Goes Unpunished.

Maybe some problems only crystallize with time and they need to be remedied, but I wish that those who are interested in acquiring a CPK see that this is a really great subforum with genuinely good people and not get too bent out of shape so quickly...

 

[Casinostocks]

... snipped!

So, after all that long winded bullshit, I guess my question is, how do you want me to handle that in the future?
Last thought - I want it noted that when the league was disbanded, I sat atop the heap it's champion. I am retiring with the belt.

Aggrandizement much? No one really cares how you handle anything in the future "Floyd"

But seriously, Nathan can easily just do sales in his own sub and have the sales thread all set but locked till 3:00 PM, like he was doing most of this past year. I suspect that he's decided to go main because he's trying to accommodate to more BFC patrons who do not necessarily hang out in here. I made a bone head mistake in the last sale because I just assumed that there were Terotuf handle scales and I'm bloody well here all the time!

Anyway, Nathan does what Nathan does and I'm sure that the good CPK folks will dial things back a few notches. You can keep that McDonalds belt which you won on Friday and wear it during with Pride

 

[Nathan the Machinist]

Yeah, as a general rule I'm not here to tell anybody what to do. If you want to proxy, fine. Chat in the thread? Great. Speed check? Okay if it's not causing any problems. But recently there have been a lot of folks coming to the sales who get a network error when they try to post due to the traffic. This isn't fun for them, it's frustrating. Knife collecting is supposed to be fun, so that is a big fail.

If half of the first 20 or 30 spots aren't actually buying anything they're contributing to that traffic in those first 10-20 seconds that some of these sales finish at, and are bumping people off the sale due to the software glitch. <--- that's the real problem. That and excessive clutter in the part of the sale thread where the actual orders are located starts to make Jo feel sad, and nobody wants that. So, until the sales either slow down a little or the server error problem is resolved I'm simply asking folks who aren't there to buy a knife to please wait a minute until the sale is over before jumping into the thread. At least until things slow down a little. Otherwise folks new to the brand who get that server error understandably become frustrated.

If you jump on a sale and the scales you want aren't available when you hear from Jo, then pass it down there and she'll handle it for you. I frequently don't know what scales we have and I never remember to ask Jo what she has squirreled away when posting the thread and she's out picking the kids up at school during the sale time...

Really, I think what's more important than anything is to recognize that Grenock won. And Matty lost. By a lot. It was hysterical.

 

[Cap’n Smudge]

If a person wants a CPK bad enough they will find a way to be in the sales thread or any of the other Exchange threads...WTB for instance.

^^^
This isn’t true.

As far as the proxy system goes it can be and has been abused a bit.
It should be a simple thing. It is supposed to be one proxy for one person who is not going to also try in the sale. And both parties involved should have this worked out and agreed upon prior to the sale. There is nothing wrong with that set up.

It is irksome to see multiple proxy posts for one person (it’s also against the “rules” as Nathan wants them). It also shows there was no communication prior to the sale between the parties. All of which is moot because Nathan has addressed it.

I typically post in the “sale proxy request” thread, days before the sale, who I will be proxying for to add to transparency. I don’t think this is necessary but I do it for the optics.

The truth is you can’t stop proxying with a rule. I could simply agree to proxy for somebody through email or pm. I could then pay for the item and have the other party pay me through PayPal. At most this will only mean it costs a little more because it would get shipped twice. You would then see the secondary market price rise to cover that shipping.

While I’m going on about things I would like to add this:
What bothers me most are the people who try and fail in a couple sales and then presume that their failure to get the knife they want is reason to tell Nathan how his business should be run. This is rude and there is no justification for it.