Issue with member “Archer59”

[JohnWE]

"Tales of woe"? seriously
I chose all those things, so what? getting a defective knife makes it okay? they are non relevant facts, there are actual other people than yourself that came up with viable solutions, at least I can do is answer them with my my consideration.
If you read the posts instead of bieng condescending you would've understood that, I am stating facts, from customs to paying overprice, non of the above has any relevance that the seller sold me something defective knife for a full price and not taking responsibility, his little ego was hurt when I called him out, again, privately not wishing any blowback regardless of my chose of words.
I read Catch 22 a very long time ago, I know exactly what I meant.

Yes, tale of woe is a good description of how you chose to respond. You waited until after you received the knife to complain about the cost being too high, that you'd have to waste your valuable time arguing with a customs agent about paying duty if you chose to send the knife in question in for repair, you called the seller a liar with no evidence and you seem to think that claiming to have been in the military once upon a time had some sort of relevance to buying a knife from a private party in another country. Calling it a tale of woe was me being polite.

As far as your having read Catch 22, you may well have and you may well think that what you described was an accurate example of what Joseph Heller meant but you'd be wrong. What you meant and what Heller meant have nothing to do with one another.

P.S. Do a little reading on the topic of "rhetoric" especially the method described as "throwing sand in the bulls eyes". You might find some relevance.

 

[JohnWE]

In that case, I have some things I'm selling. Any interest in a bridge in California?

Depends, is it new in the box...?

 

[not2sharp]

Yup, the buyer was a jerk, but nothing changes the fact that the seller failed to disclose a major defect in the knife.

.... Explain it to me, please

The seller did not sell a knife. He sold a factory sealed box said to contain a knife.

n2s

 

[Insipid Moniker]

The seller did not sell a knife. He sold a factory sealed box said to contain a knife.

n2s

Isn't that what pretty much every knife retailer sells? What's the difference?

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Depends, is it new in the box...?

I can truthfully say I've never opened or used it!

 

[JohnWE]

Yup, the buyer was a jerk, but nothing changes the fact that the seller failed to disclose a major defect in the knife.

Also, people keep insisting this is different. How? How is this in any way different from buying a knife sight unseen from a retailer? Explain it to me, please

It's different because it is. The seller was a private party selling a personal item not a retailer selling merchandise that is governed by laws.

Don't misunderstand me, this whole thing is pretty dumb but the facts seem pretty clear and contrary to the buyers contention he wasn't a victim of any dishonesty or shady behaviour. He bought exactly what was described and he did so knowing the risks. It's unfortunate but he had a chance to try and work things out and he chose to be the hapless victim insisting that the seller was dishonest.

 

[JohnWE]

I can truthfully say I've never opened or used it!

Send some pics, we'll talk...

 

[not2sharp]

Isn't that what pretty much every knife retailer sells? What's the difference?

A true retailer is usually awarded a defective allowance to deal with returns.; this was a private sale by a collector, not a retailer/dealer. I would suggest that the buyer, the person who actually opened the sealed box, should be the one to contact the manufacturer to seek a solution. He is the only witness to what was actually found in the box. The whole logistical mess was the buyer's responsibility. He should have inspected the item before committing it to international shipment, if only to protect that the item was correctly documented for importation. Furthermore, there are usually customs allowances for returning goods for warranty service, which would not be available to the other parties.

n2s

 

[JD Mandrell]

Since they both kinda made bone-head choices here, how about a suggestion to resolve it.

Buyer sends it back to Benchmade for repair/exchange, and then seller reimburses him for half the costs involved.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

A true retailer is usually awarded a defective allowance to deal with returns.; this was a private sale by a collector, not a retailer/dealer. I would suggest that the buyer, the person who actually opened the sealed box, should be the one to contact the manufacturer to seek a solution. He is the only witness to what was actually found in the box. The whole logistical mess was the buyer's responsibility. He should have inspected the item before committing it to international shipment, if only to protect that the item was correctly documented for importation. Furthermore, there are usually customs allowances for returning goods for warranty service, which would not be available to the other parties.

n2s

Retailers do often have an allowance! And how that works is the retailer takes the item back and returns the defective item to the manufacturer! And since it seems like that EXACT thing would be precisely what's in order here, why should the buyer be responsible for making sure the seller had a product that wasn't defective?

 

[Boru13]

After reading this thread a couple of times, here's my opinion.

B BM-EDC
You should have inspected the knife before you listed it for sale, just because the box was factory sealed does not absolve you of any responsibility... if you had bought the knife to keep for yourself, I'm quite sure upon opening the box and seeing the defect you would have returned the knife for either an exchange or refund.

@Archer59
You should have asked for pictures of the knife before buying it instead of being content with pictures of a knife box. You have mentioned several times in this thread that Benchmade doesn't use tape on their boxes but you were willing to purchase the knife with pictures clearly showing tape on the box... if you really believed that Benchmade didn't use tape, why in the hell would you have followed through with the purchase.

FYI, I'm good friends with a stocking Benchmade dealer, they do use the circular tape on the box.

Now I have a question for both of you.

B BM-EDC
In your for sale thread you said US sales only... did you know you were shipping to a 3rd party?

@Archer59
How did you or you friend pay for the knife?

 

[GronK]

And this is why many of us refuse to deal with anyone outside our home country. If things go sideways it's a total CF.

 

[BM-EDC]

Boru13 yes, I was aware I was sending it to a middle man who was going to ship it overseas. I have no idea at this time what country Archer59 lives in.

It was paid for via PayPal goods and services.

I disagree with your opinion that I should have opened the knife and inspected it. If I would have bought it and found an issue I would reach out to the manufacturer, in this case Benchmade, who would fix their defect. But maybe I’m weird that way.

If that scenario is too inconvenient for Archer59, perhaps he should not have willingly purchased the item sight unseen.

 

[benchwarmer380]

Boru13 yes, I was aware I was sending it to a middle man who was going to ship it overseas. I have no idea at this time what country Archer59 lives in.

It was paid for via PayPal goods and services.

I disagree with your opinion that I should have opened the knife and inspected it. If I would have bought it and found an issue I would reach out to the manufacturer, in this case Benchmade, who would fix their defect. But maybe I’m weird that way.

If that scenario is too inconvenient for Archer59, perhaps he should not have willingly purchased the item sight unseen.

Umm, all due respect, but the bold is quite contradictory. You DID buy it but did not inspect it. Why is the burden of inspection on the second person to buy it and not the first?

I do agree that he should not have bought it sight unseen, but you also should not have sold it sight unseen. That's a two way street and y'all both went down the wrong way.

 

[Boru13]

Boru13
I disagree with your opinion that I should have opened the knife and inspected it.

I have no problem with you disagreeing with me, in the future though, you should consider this... from the Exchange rules.

1. When describing your items, be honest and provide an accurate & detailed description of the item. Don't forget to mention defects, blemishes, new, used, or other problems. When in doubt, be pessimistic with your descriptions. If you have a problem being honest, upfront, and are unable to honor your word then you do not belong here.

 

[BM-EDC]

You're right, plenty of large retailers do that. Guess what their customers do if they recieve a knife like this? THEY RETURN IT! You failed to disclose a defect. Period. End of story. Doesn't matter that you didn't know about it, that's literally no kind of excuse.

I have no problem with you disagreeing with me, in the future though, you should consider this... from the Exchange rules.

1. When describing your items, be honest and provide an accurate & detailed description of the item. Don't forget to mention defects, blemishes, new, used, or other problems. When in doubt, be pessimistic with your descriptions. If you have a problem being honest, upfront, and are unable to honor your word then you do not belong here.

I fail to see how I did not comply with that rule.

 

[BM-EDC]

Umm, all due respect, but the bold is quite contradictory. You DID buy it but did not inspect it. Why is the burden of inspection on the second person to buy it and not the first?

I do agree that he should not have bought it sight unseen, but you also should not have sold it sight unseen. That's a two way street and y'all both went down the wrong way.

Disagree. It should not have left BKC in that way. By your standard, it should not have left SMKW that way either. So the onus falls on me specifically, why? The buyer assumed the same risk I took when I purchased it. Literally no difference. I literally opened the package from SMKW and listed it for sale with a 100% accurate description.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Disagree. It should not have left BKC in that way. By your standard, it should not have left SMKW that way either. So the onus falls on me specifically, why? The buyer assumed the same risk I took when I purchased it. Literally no difference. I literally opened the package from SMKW and listed it for sale with a 100% accurate description.

Because you could return it to SMKW for a full refund, something that you're vehemently denying the buyer.

 

[benchwarmer380]

Disagree. It should not have left BKC in that way. By your standard, it should not have left SMKW that way either. So the onus falls on me specifically, why? The buyer assumed the same risk I took when I purchased it. Literally no difference. I literally opened the package from SMKW and listed it for sale with a 100% accurate description.

Yes, I agree that it should not have left Benchmade that way. The dealer trusts that the manufacturer will give them a solid product and most times they do. We all would like dealers to inspect every single knife that comes through their hands to stop lemons in their tracks but I have no idea of how feasible that is. It's probably not or lemons would never go out to the public and would go straight back to the manufacturer.

I say the onus is on you as you are the first end user to purchase it. You purchased it from the dealer and if you had an issue you could have brought it up with them or the manufacturer. That is the difference.

All New In Box means it that it is New In Box. What if it came brand new from the factory and had no edge to speak of or was missing an Omega spring? You could still call that NIB and not be a liar because Brand New In Box Straight From The Factory Still Sealed, while true, is not an accurate (or any kind of) description of the actual item.

 

[-Corey-]

Disagree. It should not have left BKC in that way. By your standard, it should not have left SMKW that way either. So the onus falls on me specifically, why? The buyer assumed the same risk I took when I purchased it. Literally no difference. I literally opened the package from SMKW and listed it for sale with a 100% accurate description.

You're right, it shouldn't have left the factory that way, but they are willing to take back a defective item. It also shouldn't have left SMKW that way, but again, they are willing to take back a defective item. You sold it that way and are unwilling to take back the defective item.